Tracing history of E.H. Scott 33 Tube Philharmonic

[Erik johnson]

Hi, awhile back I obtained an old radio but recently realized it might be a little special.  I just enjoy looking at it as it has not been restored.  I believe it's a 33 Tube Philharmonic.  The serial number is GG400.  It came with an old scott radio magazine and on the envelope, it stated that an employee from HP purchased from David Packard (founder of HP) directly.  Also, inside of the cabinet were two wooden blocks from Douglas aircraft with what I believe could be asset numbers.  I am thinking maybe it was purchased by the aircraft company and then David.  IDK.  Anyway, I would love to trace this to David Packard.  Any Ideas how?  I have read that all of the EH Scott purchase records are long gone.

Also, I believe this version had an option to purchase a remote.  I would love to track one of these down and purchase so my radio is more complete if anyone has one, they would sell. 

  Thank you!

Erik

[Scott Seickel]

That is a later AM/FM Philharmonic with remote control option in a Warrington cabinet.  These AM/FM Philharmonics and Warrington cabinets are relatively common, but what makes this uncommon is the remote option.  There just aren't a lot of sets out there with this option.  The remotes are often missing and very, very hard to get.    It would plug into the rear of the upper chassis. 

As for tracing it back to David Packard, short of more paperwork from the actual transaction between David and his buyer,  it would be impossible. 

[Erik johnson]

Thanks for that information. I also realize that if I get the chance to buy a remote it will have to be the kind that would work on a 33 tube version and not a 30 tube version.  I saw one that was auctioned and it was listed as a 30 tube remote. 
thanks 

[Brad Winder]

Erik, you will probably want to see if HP has a historical archive within the company; many large companies do. There possibly may be historical records or photographs. If nothing exists within the company, they still may be able to steer you towards another possible source.

[Erik johnson]

Good idea!  Thanks 

Brad Winder said:

Erik, you will probably want to see if HP has a historical archive within the company; many large companies do. There possibly may be historical records or photographs. If nothing exists within the company, they still may be able to steer you towards another possible source.

[David C. Poland]

Eric - The remote control keyboard (prewar version) functions with any pre war Scott radio having the remote control option, which could be any Philharmonic, or Phantom, or Sixteen, ...  That big circular housing on the rear of the receiver  has the 12 station presets and, so, is the telltale sign of having remote control. Depending on the particular example, that key board not only has buttons for 12 radio stations, buttons also turn the radio on and off and adjust volume, but may also control an installed phonograph, if it was one of certain Garrard models.

(The post war keyboard for the Scott 800B looks the same (brown or ivory) but is wired differently, so not compatible.)

The keyboard is rare to find now. photo:  IMG_1187.JPG

As I commented on Reddit, the Philharmonic is top of the line. A restoration is pretty involved but possible with the information available here. The instruction manual is available in the Info Archive on this website, above - select Set Folders, then look for FM Philharmonic. Also, see the Robot item for info on the remote control option yours has.

[Erik johnson]

David- thank you so much for this information.  I really appreciate it.  

[Kent King]

Erik -

That is a fantastic note with the set. I had an Allwave 23 with a note that it had been owned by one of FDRs Secret Service agents, but could never find anything. I did give your set and note some thought. I have a huge list of famous Scott owners...no David Packard on it though. I've been thinking about the timing:

David Packard was born in 1912, and this set was built pretty close to 1941 (very late 1940, early 41). That would make Mr Packard about 29. Now Packard and Hewlett had started the company in 1937 or so, it seems unlikely that he would have had the finances to purchase this set at that time (about 1/2 the cost of a new car at the time). However - HPs first products were audio generators and other test equipment. It might be possible that Mr Packard might have traded some equipment for a set. Scott could get some good test equipment and HP might be able to say they had equipment with Scott Radio Laboratories. That might be something to look for- early customer recommendations for HP...was Scott in there? Another possibility is that Mr Packard couldn't afford the set in 1941, but knew of the quality and reputation and perhaps was able to buy a good used set following WW2. There is certainly no reason to doubt the note, it would just be nice to confirm David Packard did own one. 

Dave Poland explained that all the pre-war remote control sets used the same control with a 21pin connector. An 800B post war remote could potentially be rewired for pre-war set use, but either of them is almost impossible to find. Keep watching, and if it is a pre-war remote, go for it! Restoring an FM Philharmonic is a big challenge even for a very experienced restorer. It is not a set for a novice collector/restorer. What speaker arrangement do you have in the cabinet...a single 15in pedestal, or are there a pair of tweeters too?

Thanks!

Kent

[Erik johnson]

Hi Kent,

Thank you so much for that detailed response.  I think you are correct that it does not make sense that David would have purchased this new from the company.  That was a smart observation.  I attached a photo of a block with a Douglas aircraft number on it that I found in the cabinet.   I wonder if that was an asset tag and Douglas aircraft purchased it and maybe David purchased it from them later.  

There is only one speaker.  I attached a photo.  

it would be fun to have it restored but i definitely lack the required intelligence and patience so i will just enjoy it.  

thanks,

erik

IMG_7610.jpeg

IMG_7608.jpeg

[Norman S Braithwaite]

I can't recall seeing an AM-FM Philharmonic with the remote option before now.  If the remote is wired to operate on both AM an FM, an additional remote operated switch will be included under the tuner chassis.  Either the remote will work only for AM only (no additional switch) or it may be wired similar to the postwar 800B addressing both AM and FM (additional switch present).  It is also possible that the remote was custom wired to address both AM and FM.   Once a remote is procured, it will need to be checked and/or modified to work with the tuner.  If you are interested in constructing a reproduction remote, I have a reproduced case, buttons and baseplate along with a correct size pilot lamp available.  Internally, the remote only included switches and the pilot lamp.

Norman

Norman

[David C. Poland]

Perhaps the band switch is wired to operate an AM/FM relay switch. Such as switch is needed to switch from AM circuitry to the FM circuitry. 

Note - The big 15 inch standard pedestal speaker has a spherical wizer at the voice coil to help high frequency response.

Eric - the FM option required several additional tubes and coils. Took more than just 3 additional tubes. So the 5 tube volume expander circuit of the standard 30 tube AM Philly was deleted to help make room for the FM circuitry and tubes totaling 33. This additional wiring makes for a more involved electrical restoration than the standard 30 tube Philly, which is already pretty involved. And - Scott was a custom set builder, building each radio upon receiving the purchase order, and so, was capable of building unique examples.

Norman & Kent -The later production high fi speaker system included a separate cable to the receiver to a small 5 pin socket which, in turn, was wired to an additional wafer on the band switch controlling the tweeters to functioned only on FM. With the standard pedestal 15 inch speaker there is no such cable to control a tweeter set. So maybe that wafer is on the band switch, repurposed to operate an AM/FM relay.

My experience is that the small 5 pin socket is sometimes wired for phonograph operation and sometimes wired on later 1940-41 receivers to control the tweeters for the optional hi-fi speaker system. So - wise to trace that wiring to determine how the small socket is purposed before using it.

Eric  - does your Philly have a separate phono terminal strip somewhere on the back of the receiver?

[David C. Poland]

On further reflection, guess you would need to operate the band switch by hand to turn to the FM band. Don't see that would be automated from the keyboard.

With two rows of preset stops on the receiver rear housing, you might devote one row for FM and the other for AM stations. Maybe figure a way too mark which keyboard buttons are FM station presets. The station call letter inserts for the buttons are kinda small. On the post war 800B, the panel buttons a larger and so the call letter button inserts I made were different color to distinguish AM from FM station buttons. Not so easy on the smaller keyboard buttons.

Seems to me a fussy task, but postwar keyboard should be possible to rewire for the pre war arrangement. Same 21 pin Jones plug, And we have the wiring information. Unfortunately, the insulation is pretty old and may not survive handling.

Be interesting to study how this example is built, eh Norman?  :>)

[Norman S Braithwaite]

Yes, the postwar remote keyboard can be rewired to work for the prewar sets.  Not so easy to do the opposite.  Unlike the prewar remote keyboards, the postwar remote keyboards employed vinyl insulated wire.  Also, yes, it would be interesting to study the remote operation in an AM-FM chassis.

Norman