I have questions about my 7-knob BOL Philly with Robot Control

[Bob Snively]

I am starting this discussion because I have questions about my Philharmonic as I embark on a quest to restore it to optimum performance.

I have included pics of the dial and knobs. 

Other than what I have found on this forum, is there any documented restoration of the robot control? Wiring diagrams or schematics?

Does anyone have any pictures of their push/pull scratch suppressor switch and it's related shaft/knob? Mine has a rotary on/off switch and the knob configuration makes it rather awkward for manual tuning due to its close proximity to the tuning knob.

[David C. Poland]

The scratch suppressor switch is like this photo, shown with handle extended. 

it is a vintage lamp switch. (A power tool switch has a larger diameter shank.) Was a challenge to find when I sought one. Meanwhile a long shank toggle switch from an Ace Hardware might suffice. 

But needs a bit longer shank than my example so in a cabinet it protrudes enough to grasp the end to pull it out.

IMG_0523.jpeg

IMG_0524.jpeg

When you look at Philly diagram, you should probably use the one dated in 1937. The later 1939 diagram in Riders vol 14 page 43 has a number of revisions yours predates, like the additional two controls.

If you have no cabinet, you should at least have a large baffle board for the 15 inch speaker for sake of sound quality.

[Scott Seickel]

The early remote sets do not have a push-pull scratch switch, but rather have a rotary one.  And yes, it is jammed in to the tuning knob which makes manual tuning difficult.  The remote sets are 10 pounds of you know what in a 5 pound bag.  No schematic for the remote Philharmonics exists.  All the other circuitry is the same as the non-remote sets other than what is added for the remote.  The only available wiring diagrams that are similar are from the 800B which is post WW2.  They can serve as a guide to what is going on with the remote tuning and understanding it.   I don't know of any documented restorations, though I know both Kent and Norman here have done restorations on them.  I purchased a restored remote several years back, but it needs to be gone thru again.  The tuning is nearly frozen and needs a complete disassembly and lube.  No time yet to get that done....worse yet my new house is a hotbed of RFI that is not easily solved.  

I have all the 800B remote documentation available plus some notes on the Philharmonic remote that I can email you if you want.  

As for your questions on the Serial Numbers thread:

"If I understand your information, this is most likely a very early BOL and the remote is a bonus. Since it's not considered a different "version", it's most likely not of any greater value than any other Philly?

I'm in this for the shear pleasure of owning and listening to a Philly. I like the BOL dial style and illumination. I'm hoping that since this has the phono input, I will be able to plug in a Bluetooth device for streaming purposes, also."

Yes, it is the very first BOL set.  Remotes were an option on all sets as far as I know.   As for value, it is in the eyes of the beholder.  I personally think the later 9 knob sets are more valuable as a collector due to the revisions that made them perform better.  For someone who wants every variation, this is the hardest set to get.  

3 Major Variations of Philharmonic:
• April 1937 Philharmonic 7 knob AM introduced. (variation 1)
o Dial pointer was used initially and later changed to beam of light dial in November 1938.
o The beam of light dial can be found with or without logging scale.
o Dials were available with East Coast, West Coast or Chicago station call letters, or no station call letters at all.
o Some radios were produced with a gold background behind dial.
o Can be found with optional remote.
o VR150 tube was relocated to front of chassis on the later beam of light version, but no major circuit revisions were made during the 7 knob AM run.

• March 1939 EH Scott introduced the 9 knob AM Philharmonic. (variation 2)
o A number of circuit changes were introduced, including adding a treble control and making the scratch suppressor rotary instead of a push/pull switch.  The scratch suppressor was located on the right side to balance the new treble control.  
o Logging scale is found on sets starting approx 1940.
o Ultra high frequency band in red lettering is sometimes found on sets of this variation.
o Can be found with optional remote.
o Radio now tuned up to 60 Mhz instead of 80 Mhz of the predecessor.  Some of the RF and /or IF coils are different.  Have not documented which ones.  

• August 1940 EH Scott introduced the AM/FM Philharmonic (variation 3)
o FM was added. (42 to 50 Mhz)
o Volume expander was removed and AM circuit was revamped post detector.
o Sets all had logging scale.
o Can be found with optional remote.

These are difficult sets to get working properly.  Generally not for the impatient or inexperienced.  

As for your using the phono input for bluetooth, this is very common among radio collectors, but you are not using 75% of the circuitry.  Using a low power am transmitter would allow you to use the entire circuitry, but of course the quality won't be quite as good.  Just an option.  

[David C. Poland]

I had a 1940 Philly BOL with remote control and still have a Phantom Deluxe with it.

The keyboard itself should present no problem, unless the wiring insulation has failed like mine has. Crumbling insulation risks electrical shorts and strange keyboard action for this 24 volt system.

The motor drive, gears and the tuning capacitor should move pretty freely. If not, fix it. Then a little light oil like sewing machine oil or air tool lubricant which is a 10 weight non-detergent - not 3 in 1 oil, not grease, not WD-40 which may get gummy with time.

Riders documentation for the postwar 800 B has detailed keyboard wiring. Prewar version is wired differently.

The now inactive EHS Historical Society published the prewar wiring which I have if someone needs it.

   The prewar remote keyboard 12 station presets start with Jones plug pin 10. 

   The postwar keyboards 12 station presets start with Jones plug pin1

I had more problem with the motorized volume control, getting it loose enough to move freely.

Scott - your time line makes sense - that the two additional controls appeared earlier 1939, months before the addition of the logging scale at the top of the dial for late 1939 for the "new 1940 model". Scott's history of set evolution during a model run helps explain why the early 7 knob BOL dial model was a short run and so seldom seen. 

[Norman S Braithwaite]

The rotary scratch suppressor switch was necessary on the early remote control sets because the push-pull switch interfered with frame of the motor for remote tuning.

Norman

[Bob Snively]

As they say, a picture is worth a thousand words. Thank you for sharing this info and especially the pictures. The rotary scratch suppressor switch is what my unit has but I am considering finding a push/pull switch that will fit in the tight confines created by the tuning motor location. I can see where it would be less obtrusive to have the smaller diameter shaft versus a knob for ease of manual tuning.

I have the cabinet for this unit, it's a Warrington.

David C. Poland said:

The scratch suppressor switch is like this photo, shown with handle extended. 

it is a vintage lamp switch. (A power tool switch has a larger diameter shank.) Was a challenge to find when I sought one. Meanwhile a long shank toggle switch from an Ace Hardware might suffice. 

But needs a bit longer shank than my example so in a cabinet it protrudes enough to grasp the end to pull it out.

IMG_0523.jpeg

IMG_0524.jpeg

When you look at Philly diagram, you should probably use the one dated in 1937. The later 1939 diagram in Riders vol 14 page 43 has a number of revisions yours predates, like the additional two controls.

If you have no cabinet, you should at least have a large baffle board for the 15 inch speaker for sake of sound quality.

[Scott Seickel]

David, I would like a copy of the EHS historical Society prewar wiring please.  Might come in handy as my Philharmonic remote set  has a post war 800b remote that needs to be rewired accordingly. 

Email:  Polaraligned (at) Optonline.net

Thank you.  

[Bob Snively]

Scott, thank you for all of this wonderful documentation. So you believe this is the very first model to have the Beam of Light dial. Is this based on its serial number? This unit also has the VR150 located at the front of the chassis.

Scott Seickel said:

The early remote sets do not have a push-pull scratch switch, but rather have a rotary one.  And yes, it is jammed in to the tuning knob which makes manual tuning difficult.  The remote sets are 10 pounds of you know what in a 5 pound bag.  No schematic for the remote Philharmonics exists.  All the other circuitry is the same as the non-remote sets other than what is added for the remote.  The only available wiring diagrams that are similar are from the 800B which is post WW2.  They can serve as a guide to what is going on with the remote tuning and understanding it.   I don't know of any documented restorations, though I know both Kent and Norman here have done restorations on them.  I purchased a restored remote several years back, but it needs to be gone thru again.  The tuning is nearly frozen and needs a complete disassembly and lube.  No time yet to get that done....worse yet my new house is a hotbed of RFI that is not easily solved.  

I have all the 800B remote documentation available plus some notes on the Philharmonic remote that I can email you if you want.  

As for your questions on the Serial Numbers thread:

"If I understand your information, this is most likely a very early BOL and the remote is a bonus. Since it's not considered a different "version", it's most likely not of any greater value than any other Philly?

I'm in this for the shear pleasure of owning and listening to a Philly. I like the BOL dial style and illumination. I'm hoping that since this has the phono input, I will be able to plug in a Bluetooth device for streaming purposes, also."

Yes, it is the very first BOL set.  Remotes were an option on all sets as far as I know.   As for value, it is in the eyes of the beholder.  I personally think the later 9 knob sets are more valuable as a collector due to the revisions that made them perform better.  For someone who wants every variation, this is the hardest set to get.  

3 Major Variations of Philharmonic:
• April 1937 Philharmonic 7 knob AM introduced. (variation 1)
o Dial pointer was used initially and later changed to beam of light dial in November 1938.
o The beam of light dial can be found with or without logging scale.
o Dials were available with East Coast, West Coast or Chicago station call letters, or no station call letters at all.
o Some radios were produced with a gold background behind dial.
o Can be found with optional remote.
o VR150 tube was relocated to front of chassis on the later beam of light version, but no major circuit revisions were made during the 7 knob AM run.

• March 1939 EH Scott introduced the 9 knob AM Philharmonic. (variation 2)
o A number of circuit changes were introduced, including adding a treble control and making the scratch suppressor rotary instead of a push/pull switch.  The scratch suppressor was located on the right side to balance the new treble control.  
o Logging scale is found on sets starting approx 1940.
o Ultra high frequency band in red lettering is sometimes found on sets of this variation.
o Can be found with optional remote.
o Radio now tuned up to 60 Mhz instead of 80 Mhz of the predecessor.  Some of the RF and /or IF coils are different.  Have not documented which ones.  

• August 1940 EH Scott introduced the AM/FM Philharmonic (variation 3)
o FM was added. (42 to 50 Mhz)
o Volume expander was removed and AM circuit was revamped post detector.
o Sets all had logging scale.
o Can be found with optional remote.

These are difficult sets to get working properly.  Generally not for the impatient or inexperienced.  

As for your using the phono input for bluetooth, this is very common among radio collectors, but you are not using 75% of the circuitry.  Using a low power am transmitter would allow you to use the entire circuitry, but of course the quality won't be quite as good.  Just an option.  

[Scott Seickel]

Yes Bob, the 7 knob set is the first to have the beam of light.  Not based on serial numbers, but we know based on EH Scott advertising and other documentation the sequence of the major designs.  Look in the archives tab on the upper far right for EH Scott News folder.  Kent has posted many copies and you can scroll thru them to get a timeline idea of the different sets.  The serial numbers are mostly worthless dating a set unless there is a set with a very close number that has been documented with original bill of sale.  As I stated earlier, Scott jumped around in the different serial number prefix series with different revisions of the Philharmonic. 

The beam of light design was not originated by EH Scott.  The dial pointer, which was the first Philharmonic, had a traveling round dot of light that went with the pointer.  It just made sense to get rid of the pointer mechanism and use a slit of light to indicate tuning.  

[David C. Poland]

Bob - Check the photo section and look at the Jan 14 photo of Leonad Sports photo 9753 of the bottom view of his pointer Philly. it shows a factory original scratch suppressor switch.

Scott - image of EHS Historical June 1999 issue on the pre war remote keyboard plug wiring. IMG_0525.jpeg